›
To take part in discussions on talkSFU, please apply for membership (SFU email id required).

Should tipping be mandatory?

Ether
edited March 2008 in General
I've noticed that certain workers basically expect a tip these days. If you don't tip, it's looked at as almost "stealing" from them. At some places (restaurants, hotels, etc.) it's like an unwritten rule that you must leave a substantial tip. Personally, I don't get it.

What do you think of being "expected" to leave a tip?

Comments

  • randomuser
    edited March 2008
    in general no matter what i always tip at least five dollars, i mean i wouldnt if i never got the food, or got the wrong food, or wasnt served, but i really dont care if the person kisses my ass or is peppy

    some people go on how they want the person to be overly nice etc i really dont care

    i personally wouldnt want to do their job, and im sure they make near min wage or maybe a dollar over, i mean its the least you can do for such shitty jobs, most places the tipping is spread through most of the staff so its not like the person is pulling in 500 dollars a shift in tips, then again in some places ive known of people making an extra 100-200 a night on a good night

    either way its just an extra five dollars, if it really matters and youre that broke maybe you shouldnt be eating out

    i wouldnt care if i went somewhere and it was included in the bill
  • Furia101
    edited March 2008
    I think they've been too accustomed to receiving tips everytime that they're starting to expect it. I don't like how they seem to get greedier and greedier. 99% of the time, I'm usually satisfied with service.. unless the food doesn't come, or shit happens.. but I think I've been quite accustomed to giving tips as well, to the point that I sometimes regret it, like that time where I decided to get haircut at cornerstone:

    me: cut my hair like this (shows a nice picture), and leave the front a little longer
    lady: ok!

    she starts showing off her skills by trimming the hair from an unconventional angle, but after a few minutes

    lady: hmm... I can't seem to get the correct weight line *tries really hard*

    she cuts it shorter and shorter, looking totally opposite to what I wanted, resulting in an unshapely, unattractive furball hairstyle with uneven sides.
    I felt like I could do a better job with a shaver in front of the mirror.
    Oh, she also cut the front short, which enrages me since I've given specific instructions not to do so. It was so obviously bad looking, but she STILL couldn't tell how to fix it. It turned out to be something like crew cut with bulging sides.

    and she says: All done!!

    she takes the cape off... and few seconds later she says "oh I have to fix this "

    so she making a few more adjustments.... WITHOUT the cape, and got hair all over me, which just ruined the whole purpose of putting the cape on in the first place. Damn stupid lady. I just wanted to get out of there.

    fuckn waste of 14 bucks

    my classic 7/cut barber does a way better job

    I asked the lady at the counter if people usually tipped... she said it was up to them. I sort of felt bad for the lady who tried so hard and did such a horrible job, but i spared her a little more than a dollar.

    I regretted that.


    I feel like certain hairdressers there weren't meant to be, but was able to work there because their friends opened a business and wanted some help

    ummmmmmm i think im off topic but i gota sleep now
  • Shizunda
    edited March 2008
    Service workers in restaurants, hotels, small businesses should be honored to have me as a customer. The fee for their service is adequate enough to compensate their work. I would only give a tip if I were to return again or I find that the provided service is outstanding.

    The expectation is service personnel in accomodation and hospitality should be at their knees, bowing to customers.

    On the other hand, if I were to go to a special professional such as a lawyer. A bonus like a tip would be offered if an exceptional or a timely criteria is needed and met for a job.
  • lazyGUY
    edited March 2008
    randomuser;24651 said:


    i personally wouldnt want to do their job, and im sure they make near min wage or maybe a dollar over, i mean its the least you can do for such shitty jobs
    I disagree with the fact that they deserve a tip just because there doing min. wage jobs. i mean its not hard to find a higher paying job without certain experience or education. i had a job in high school that payed 15 an hour working in a warehouse.

    Also, I cooked at a restaurant for a while and i hate it how the servers act like they dont give a shit about there job and do the bare minimum of work, and they still made more money than me with there tips and whatnot. Even worse is when they dont get a tip and come to the kitchen and bitch about it to the ppl that dont get any tips at all.
  • vonnie
    edited March 2008
    No, they should not even EXPECT tip. Tip is something we give them for being good at servicing us, an effort that surpasses what they job requires them to do. They can't expect someone to give them extra money just for doing their job and nothing else. That's what they're hourly wage is for: Doing their job.

    Waiters were HIRED to serve. They were hired to wait tables. They have such a twisted mentality that they deserve money on top of their wage for doing their regular job.

    I mean, if I go to say Burger King, and order food at the counter, they still serve me my food. If they said it's going to take 5 extra minutes, they'll bring it to me when I'm at my table. If I ask for more Honey Mustard sauce, they'll give it to me. Do they expect tip for serving me? No.

    Then there are those people that say "I depend on that tip to earn a living!" Well then get a higher paying job, or work more hours. Don't expect people to just throw money at you cuz you need it. We all have a job to earn a living, and we don't expect extra money. Secretaries don't. Professors don't.

    Nobody expects more money than their wage except servers. Couriers work just as hard to deliver packages to their receivers. They don't expect tip either.

    Waiters in Hong Kong don't get tipped. It's perfectly normal over there to no get tip. Why? Because they're just doing their job.
  • IVTIVT
    edited March 2008
    vonnie: I agree. I'm going to stir the pot a bit though....

    On a dinner date for which the guy pays if he doesn't tip, his date will think of him as "cheap." Right? Therefore us guys are pressured into tipping regardless of quality of service.
  • Shi2
    edited March 2008
    I only tip around 10% when I'm satisfied. If I'm not satisfied, then I leave less tips, but never none. Especially when I go to the same restaurant often, giving tips might give me some benefits in the long run. As a joke sometimes, we always say that if we don't leave tips, the waiters/waitresses will remember our faces and give us something "extra" if we go back again.

    To answer the question, I think tipping shouldn't be mandatory. But since everyone already leaves tips, it would look bad for me not to.
  • vonnie
    edited March 2008
    Shi2;24664 said:
    To answer the question, I think tipping shouldn't be mandatory. But since everyone already leaves tips, it would look bad for me not to.
    See, that's the thing nowadays. People think they're SUPPOSE to leave tip, which is why everyone does. It's so twisted that if someone doesn't, it's a huge deal. It shouldn't be, and you should not leave tip if you're not satisfied.
  • Broken Lizard
    edited March 2008
    all tipping does is allow the employer to give them a low wage.
  • Morro
    edited March 2008
    I don't mind tipping for very good service. But the expectation of a tip is ridiculous. Why does a waitress deserve a tip, but a landscaper doesn't? They're both probably making minimum wage, but one warries plates and writes orders, while the other carries 60lbs of sod or lumber up ladders. They both make the same hourly wage... but who works harder? The tipping system is just based off of those workers who we come into contact with the most directly. We don't tip landscapers because we don't interact with them, and thus don't feel bad.

    I tip maybe a fifth of the time, for when I get really good service. If all the server did was bring my food and put it down in front of me, then that has earner her the hourly wage she receives. If she wants more, she should do more.
  • randomuser
    edited March 2008
    Shizunda;24656 said:

    On the other hand, if I were to go to a special professional such as a lawyer. A bonus like a tip would be offered if an exceptional or a timely criteria is needed and met for a job.
    You would tip a LAWYER? That is pretty interesting, being a lot of lawyers work on billable hours and inflate them as is, and charge a super high rate as it is. There is no reason whatsoever to tip a lawyer unless youre in the mafia or something and are going to be needing their service frequently...I've never heard of people tipping lawyers like ever

    And triple you cant believe tipping allows them to pay min wage...seriously, all the other minimum wage jobs pay minimum wage in the service sector when they arent accustomed to receiving tips

    All in all tipping shouldnt be mandatory, but to me theres something about being served by other human beings that makes me want to tip, its not like they are slaves, but for what they are paid...and many places make the servers split the tips with kitchen staff etc
  • 中国&#30
    edited March 2008
    I think what Shizunda is saying is that if a lawyer is motivated to do extra work for a monetary sum in which the transaction is not recorded, the lawyer is getting paid under the table for the additional effort. Giving a bonus to a lawyer isn't something one usually mentions since it is sort of a "give $20 to the bouncer to bypass the lineup" bribe.
  • randomuser
    edited March 2008
    I would only agree with your interpretation if it applied to maybe a lawyer friend you know, or lawyers who do not work in firms.

    I would never ever ever tip a lawyer working for a firm, it doesn't even work like that. If a lawyer in a firm accepts a tip under the table it is completely immoral. Also a lawyer in a firm wouldn't go above and beyond cause again its all billable hours in the end.

    Maybe I would agree if it was just a random lawyer with no affiliation with any firm or company...but really thats not really the typical lawyer
  • vonnie
    edited March 2008
    randomuser;24676 said:
    All in all tipping shouldnt be mandatory, but to me theres something about being served by other human beings that makes me want to tip, its not like they are slaves, but for what they are paid...and many places make the servers split the tips with kitchen staff etc
    This is why we pay them their hourly wage. if we didn't THEN they'd be our slaves. Since they are paid already to be a waiter, then they should do their job description and serve without asking for more.
  • imelting
    edited March 2008
    the expectation of a tip is bs, ppl need to get that idea out of their head, they are not entitled to a tip, it should be earned like their regular wage

    the whole selective tipping in certain industries and professions is totally ridiculous too (i doubt this will ever change, we've been doin it 'this' way for too long to all of a sudden start/stop tipping certain ppl and what not)
  • baby e
    edited March 2008
    I only tip if they are good. If the service sucks, they dont get a tip. Might be mean but I could care less. And i used to be a server too.
  • IVTIVT
    edited March 2008
    i thought tipping was for restaurants/bars only.
  • Broken Lizard
    edited March 2008
    vonnie;24687 said:
    This is why we pay them their hourly wage. if we didn't THEN they'd be our slaves. Since they are paid already to be a waiter, then they should do their job description and serve without asking for more.
    but the employers pay them fuck all because they expect them to make most their money off tips.

    I delivered pizza for a bit, the amount they paid me was enough for gas, the only money I made profit was from tips.

    all tipping does it allow employers to make more money from cheaping out on wages
  • Insatiable
    edited March 2008
    Essentially, tipping stimulates the economy. It is a well known fact that employers do indeed pay their workers nearly minimum wage and expect that they make the rest of their money off of tips. If the employers paid their workers more and didn't expect them to be tipped, prices for basic services (haircuts, food, etc.) would be about 15% more expensive (assuming the employers would want the same amount of profit). As such, fewer people would spend their money on conventional services :wink:

    With that being said, I don't agree with the notion that, say, a waitress should expect a tip for service that is satisfactory. You want to make extra money on top of your jack-shit wage? Well, first of all, find a better job; but secondly, you better demonstrate some near-motherly warmth when you're bringing me my food if you want more out of me than a "please" and a "thank you"!!11111

    Now here's a question that is of truly serious ethical ramifications :tongue: : would you be willing to tip a conventional amount for food that was prepared badly but served well?
  • Shi2
    edited March 2008
    Insatiable;24706 said:

    Now here's a question that is of truly serious ethical ramifications :tongue: : would you be willing to tip a conventional amount for food that was prepared badly but served well?
    No way. The amount of tips I give depends on my mood which depends on how satisfied I am with the service and food quality. And if I know it's a restaurant I won't be returning due to the bad food, I'll pay almost no tips.
  • Insatiable
    edited March 2008
    And what about when the food is prepared well but served satisfactorily? :tongue::tongue::tongue::tongue::tongue:
  • vonnie
    edited March 2008
    Triple;24704 said:
    but the employers pay them fuck all because they expect them to make most their money off tips.

    I delivered pizza for a bit, the amount they paid me was enough for gas, the only money I made profit was from tips.

    all tipping does it allow employers to make more money from cheaping out on wages
    This is why there is a minimum wage. $8 to do their job, and they got themselves into it. It's their fault thinking they're going to get more when they signed up for the $8/hr job.

    When i worked at Playland Games for $8.19/hr, I didn't expect someone to pay me extra $2 for helping their kid throw a dart at a balloon, or exchange their smaller prizes for a bigger one.

    I still got shitty pay.
  • imelting
    edited March 2008
    to the good food bad service or good service bad food statement

    i tip based on the overall quality of the whole experience, but more bias towards the server, than the food, if that makes sense :)
  • Broken Lizard
    edited March 2008
    vonnie;24713 said:
    This is why there is a minimum wage. $8 to do their job, and they got themselves into it. It's their fault thinking they're going to get more when they signed up for the $8/hr job.

    When i worked at Playland Games for $8.19/hr, I didn't expect someone to pay me extra $2 for helping their kid throw a dart at a balloon, or exchange their smaller prizes for a bigger one.

    I still got shitty pay.
    umm they took the job at 8/hr because they expected tips. If there were none, no one would take that job at 8/hr. Thats why I'm saying employers get to cheap out because if there were no tips they would have to pay more.

    Yes theres certain jobs that pay 8/hr that dont get tips, but some of the ones that do get paid 8 an hour because they are expected to make most their money off tips.

    For example.
    A waiter. I don't know the average wage, but let's assume it is 9 an hour. Now if there were no tips at all, ever, someone would not take that job at 9 an hour. Therefore the employers would have to pay more, say 13 an hour. But since there are tips, people take the job at 9 an hour because of the tips.

    All I'm getting at is tipping is retarded because it saves employers money.
  • primexx
    edited March 2008
    Triple;24730 said:
    umm they took the job at 8/hr because they expected tips. If there were none, no one would take that job at 8/hr. Thats why I'm saying employers get to cheap out because if there were no tips they would have to pay more.

    Yes theres certain jobs that pay 8/hr that dont get tips, but some of the ones that do get paid 8 an hour because they are expected to make most their money off tips.

    For example.
    A waiter. I don't know the average wage, but let's assume it is 9 an hour. Now if there were no tips at all, ever, someone would not take that job at 9 an hour. Therefore the employers would have to pay more, say 13 an hour. But since there are tips, people take the job at 9 an hour because of the tips.

    All I'm getting at is tipping is retarded because it saves employers money.
    This whole tipping thing is retarded for exactly the reason you mentioned. It's become a source of income, but it shouldn't be.

    The way I see tipping is that it's on top of what they get paid to do, so I should only be expected to tip if they go beyond what their job descriptions say. Why should I tip you for something you're paid to do anyways? It just doesn't make sense.

    So I only tip exactly 10% for expected service, realising that it's part of the system and it's what they would have been paid (and where does that cost come from? that's right, the customer) had there not been tips, and tip more only when the service actually surpasses what they're required to do.

    I suppose the good thing with tips is that you could tip LESS than standard if the service is bad, something you can't do in a standard non-tipping tradition. I wonder why the restaurants haven't thought of this yet, and simply pay their waitpersons more and raise the price of food by a few dimes. It ends up earning them more money!
  • vonnie
    edited March 2008
    Like I said, It's their fault thinking they're going to get more when they signed up for the $8/hr job. I don't pity them at all.
  • Morro
    edited March 2008
    If there were none, no one would take that job at 8/hr.
    Except that, as I said, there are people who do much, much, much harder jobs, for the same pay, with no tips. And this isn't a reference to illegal immigrants working under minimum wage. Starving students like you and I work their asses off for 8 dollars an hour, and their "tip" is abuse from an angry, under-educated foreman.

    *grumble*

Leave a Comment