Interesting. Tazers exist to protect people, to give cops a way of subuing people with the MINIMUM possible pain and injury. I'm tired of people pretending that they're a big deal. I'm a big defender of tazers, and a big mocker of people who complain about having been tazed. Tazers are here for OUR protection, not the cops'. I don't think we would be seeing this come up as a horrible thing if the cops had just tackled the man to the ground and hog-tied him as he struggled around. That's less viscerally alarming to us. But, statistically, that's a FAR more dangerous proposition. Tazers were introduced as a way to subdue people as humanely as possible.
But even I want the cops to have SOME sort of reason to use them. He didn't seem to be being very uncooperative, and the airport HAS to have had someone who could have translated. So, what the hell? Unless he suddenly broke into English and said "oh, and btw I have bomb shoes" I'm not sure what their reasoning was.
I give this video a 4 out of 10 stars, because the phrase "don't taze me, bro!" was not used. ;)
Im sure you cant judge the situation just by what you saw on that crappy quality video.
Before the cops cam he was picking stuff up and throwing shit around, he was acting violent then.
However, once the cops arrived it kinda got fuzzy with the audio and video was to what was going on.
Why was he picking and throwing shit around in the beggining of the video? It's not like he was just some random non english speaking person chillin out
Meh, if they didn't taser him and he killed one of them all you would hear is "WHY DIDN'T THEY TASER HIM" It's just everyone likes to complain. I trust cops, I'm sure some are dirty but for the most part they are there to help us, even if it seems they're lazy assholes who just give tickets.
One question I got is, how many cop related taser deaths do the states have per 100k people and compare the 2. Or do they just shoot them there :p
What a disgrace! What a bloody disgrace! Just because it was an airport doesn't mean that the police should have acted so drastically. The guy had his hands at his side and only picked up a stapler. Perhaps the police should have made gestures for him to sit down. Or perhaps they should have first tried to restrain him without the tasers. I don't want to sound like a hindsight genius or anything but I'm certain there could have been a more viable solution.
I remember seeing this thing on the american news, where there was this naked guy acting crazy (he didn't take his meds or something) Ok naked guy, poses no threat. The cop tried to taser him, the guy ripped them out, tackled the cop, took his gun and shot him. Now if the cop shot him first, "OMG THEY SHOT HIM FOR NO REASON!!! DISGRACE!! FIRE HIM!!" but it would have saved the cop's life.
so who knows, maybe if they tried to tackle this guy, the same thing could have happend.
The key is to keep the cops safe, tasering was the best bet instead of physical contact. For the amount of taser incidents, how many times does someone actually die?
Someone should do a psychological case study on Police Officers one day. I've had many encounters with police over the years, and they DO tend to abuse their power. I sometimes start arguing with them just to see what their reaction will be (i'm a scientist, sue me). And many times they will start to harrass you, threaten to use force, and threaten to arrest you. As soon as I inform them that I am a university student and throw out a couple of laws I've learned from Criminology, they completely change their demeanor. Point being COPS BREAK THE RULES ALL THE TIME. The system they have in place ALLOWS them to break the rules and get away with it. All they have to do is write a report at the end of the day about the situation and what happened...couple other cops (who incidentally are usually friends) will corroborate the story in their reports, and life goes on...in fact, they laugh about that kinda stuff all the time.
As for the video, the guy wasn't doing anything at the time of the tazering. He wasn't resisting arrest, he wasn't being aggressive, he wasn't even yelling. 3 cops sorrounded him, and tazered the shit out of him until he died. Even when he's already down you can see they keep applying the voltage. What they did was completely out of line and uncalled for. I hope those cops rot in hell for what they did to that family. And all cops should rot because they tried covering up the story by saying he was drunk. HE DID NOT HAVE SUBSTANCES IN HIS BODY which was proven by the autopsy.
People don't die often from tazers, so it would be okay if they were using them for a reasonable situation. This wasn't. Is it okay for a cop to tazer you whenever they want to? Should they tazer everyone they want to arrest? Do they like tazering as opposed to the "classic" way of taking down a suspect. Lazy fucks.
It's sad that several police officers couldn't even take down one unarmed man without tazering him. Those cops represent our nation, and they have disappointed us. That said, I'm not sure what I would've done if I was in their position, but that still doesn't legitimate what they did.
Yeah I'd like to see you be a cop, dealing with idiots all day long for years on end. People trying to piss them off like yourself is really helping!! Good job! Yeah, all cops should rot, god, who cares about theft, rape, murder, if the cops were gone, this guy would have survived!! Sure tons more would have died, BUT THIS GUY WOULD BE ALIVE!! THATS ALL THAT MATTERS!!!!!!! Lazy fucks risking their lives, taking bullets, getting killed on the job... god why are they so fuckin lazy. (sure death rate isn't high, but who knows when some junky will stab you with a needle or cough malaria in your face (yes... knocked up quote)) yes im being an asshole to prove a point, but shit happens.
Again as I said people say he was doing nothing, what about before the cops got there when he was picking and throwing shit around? How come theres no explanation as to why he was acting up but just the focus on the police. It's not like he was some innocent person trying to get on a flight he was doing something that attracted attention
well i just watched it impressive fighting them still after getting tasered. so how do you know the guy just didn't give himself a heart attack from being freaked out that he was getting arrested. (like i said before, i duno what any tests revealed so tell me :P) guess they should have just beat the shit out of him cause that would have looked a lot better :P
It's sad that several police officers couldn't even take down one unarmed man without tazering him.
As I've said multiple times now, tasers were invented SPECIFICALLY so that cops wouldn't HAVE to "take down" people anymore. Again: Tasers drastically reduce rates of injury and death in people who are arrested. Standard procedure: taze first, ask questions later. And, guess what? That's the RIGHT policy. Tazing does NOT hurt you, and even people who have bad hearts are in very little danger from them. If you saw them take him down rather than taze him, THAT would have been something to criticize them about.
Let's consider the cops' situation here for a minute. There's a guy who has been damaging property and throwing things around. He is holding a metal object.
While tasering the guy may or may not have been warranted, it certainly was not "disgraceful".
The police officers did exactly what they should have, it is the media, once again, blowing things out of proportion. The RCMP did exactly what they should have, tasers are not made to kill people, nor do they usually hurt people. How this guy died because of a tasering is baffling and it should not have happened.
Who ever claimed that all police should rot and are 'lazy fucks' you are an ignorant bugger. You have no clue about anything do you? You have no idea how these men and women constantly on a daily basis risk their lives to allow us to be safe in our every day lives. You are the lazy fuck in the fact that you don't take the time to understand what these people do and you are the one who should rot.
^ i disagree. The officers did not do the right thing.
First of all, don't they have a rule that tells them to use weapons (lethal/non-lethal) as a last resort? One of the cops was heard saying some thing like "Are we going to taser him?" like 0:25 before they actually did it. 25 seconds is way too short. They should have tried to communicate with him instead of going for the easy way out. So yes, in that regard they are lazy fucks. Also, police officers are trained to give cpr right? They caused the man's heart to stop and then did jack shit about it. Once again, in that regard they are lazy fucks.
There is no "rule" telling them not to use any weapons (lethal/non-lethal) as a last resort. They are supposed to use their handgun if they feel their life is being threatened or if another's life is being threatened. If they EVER feel like they or others are threatened then they have the right to use any weapon to do what they can to stop the threat and at times they have less than a nanosecond to decide such as this case. It does not matter If it was only twenty-five seconds into a video, they saw him with what looked like a weapon and they had to stop this threat. It is much better that they used a taser than the handgun.
Communication? Bullshit. Like you have time to try and stop a crazed man by talking with him.
When they realized that his heart stopped they may not have given him cpr and why they did that I cannot tell you but that does not mean they did nothing. They called the paramedics and did what else they could have.
Once again another person knows nothing and shouldn't be putting in their two cents. You are in fact a lazy fuck for not doing anything to actually learn about the truth.
When they realized that his heart stopped they may not have given him cpr and why they did that I cannot tell you
i predict that heads will roll because of this one point. Also has become obvious that the RCMP have tried to bullshit their way out of this:
Canada.com said:
Police have said repeatedly that there were only three RCMP officers involved in the incident, but the video shows four men in RCMP uniforms.
RCMP officers have also said police did not use pepper spray because of the large number of people at the airport at the time. But the video shows Dziekanski standing alone with the four officers in an otherwise empty area, which is separated from the public area by a thick glass wall.
Although he was clearly distressed and behaving strangely "none of us felt threatened at any time. We weren't scared, women were going right up to him," said Pritchard.
Pritchard's account is in stark contrast to that given by the RCMP, who said Dziekanski had been behaving violently and erratically in the international arrivals area and they were unable to calm him.
Again why speculate when you dont know the specifics of the situation, that video was shit quality, and the guy was acting violently previously to the RCMP getting there, and I bet the airport staff are the ones who told the cops he was violent.
And the funniest thing is the RCMP are not accountable to the province like the vpd, so people if you want to make a point take it up with the federal government, cause Im sure theyre going to listen and care
It's true, they have these masks things to breath into which allows for no actual moth to mouth contact and it does not allow for bodily fluids to be transfered.
the point being that something could be done upon realizing the guy stopped breathing and that there's a striking difference between the police's testimony and what was actually shown the video...
so the video is shit quality.. but i don't think it should be undermined because of this.. there are questions that the police will need to answer in regards to their behavior but i'm more interested in knowing what's up with that ridiculous autopsy report..
i dont think theres a point in that video where you can see the guy stopped breathing
Im not saying it didn't happen but get off the cops back, its not like they go around looking for people to kill? And for the third or fourth time the guy brought the attention to himself, he didnt deserve to die but he set off the chain of events...what the hell do you expect in airports post 9/11?
Lets say the guy was acting up and the guy caught him on camera, then the guy got on a plane and punched a stewardess everyone would be crying why didnt the cops stop him at the airport, cause we'd all see that video of him acting violent
As I've said multiple times now, tasers were invented SPECIFICALLY so that cops wouldn't HAVE to "take down" people anymore. Again: Tasers drastically reduce rates of injury and death in people who are arrested.
A taser works through a current, meaning there must be two nodes in the flesh for the electricity to travel. The further apart the nodes are, the more damaging the shock (compare two nodes from one end of the forearm to the other with two nodes from one end of the body to the other). What isn't taken into account is that people may often sustain injury by falling after the shock or as a result of excited delirium produced in large part by the taser's shock.
Morro;17635 said:
Standard procedure: taze first, ask questions later. And, guess what? That's the RIGHT policy.
I've spoken with countless cops (officers, cadets, rookies, and veterans); I'm a criminology student after all. Proper policy is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS communication first. In this case communication was somewhat hindered (I say somewhat because I think the use of body language and certain gestures are universal). But unless the perpetrator is making threatening gestures, the use of any weapons is discouraged. The right procedure is to use the corresponding amount of force. If there is no immediate threat, the response should be corresponding. Similarly, a high amount of threat with little prospect for negotiation will bring about the use of appropriate force.
Morro;17635 said:
Tazing does NOT hurt you, and even people who have bad hearts are in very little danger from them. If you saw them take him down rather than taze him, THAT would have been something to criticize them about.
I mean you no offence when I say that I sincerely doubt that you have ever been zapped by a taser. It fucking hurts (X0,000 volts running through your body with newer models being more powerful). Tasers and other electroshock weapons have even been used as torture devices. In the video, no attempts were made to even restrain Dziekanski. If the four cops had not been able to restrain Dziekanski, I would have found it justifiable to use an appropriate amount of taser force (appropriate =/= lethal). Dziekanski's writhing in pain should not have served as an indicator for the officers to keep zapping him.
Comments
But even I want the cops to have SOME sort of reason to use them. He didn't seem to be being very uncooperative, and the airport HAS to have had someone who could have translated. So, what the hell? Unless he suddenly broke into English and said "oh, and btw I have bomb shoes" I'm not sure what their reasoning was.
I give this video a 4 out of 10 stars, because the phrase "don't taze me, bro!" was not used. ;)
and now million dollar question is.. what had caused his death?
Before the cops cam he was picking stuff up and throwing shit around, he was acting violent then.
However, once the cops arrived it kinda got fuzzy with the audio and video was to what was going on.
Why was he picking and throwing shit around in the beggining of the video? It's not like he was just some random non english speaking person chillin out
It's just everyone likes to complain.
I trust cops, I'm sure some are dirty but for the most part they are there to help us, even if it seems they're lazy assholes who just give tickets.
One question I got is, how many cop related taser deaths do the states have per 100k people and compare the 2. Or do they just shoot them there :p
Ok naked guy, poses no threat. The cop tried to taser him, the guy ripped them out, tackled the cop, took his gun and shot him.
Now if the cop shot him first, "OMG THEY SHOT HIM FOR NO REASON!!! DISGRACE!! FIRE HIM!!" but it would have saved the cop's life.
so who knows, maybe if they tried to tackle this guy, the same thing could have happend.
The key is to keep the cops safe, tasering was the best bet instead of physical contact.
For the amount of taser incidents, how many times does someone actually die?
As for the video, the guy wasn't doing anything at the time of the tazering. He wasn't resisting arrest, he wasn't being aggressive, he wasn't even yelling. 3 cops sorrounded him, and tazered the shit out of him until he died. Even when he's already down you can see they keep applying the voltage. What they did was completely out of line and uncalled for. I hope those cops rot in hell for what they did to that family. And all cops should rot because they tried covering up the story by saying he was drunk. HE DID NOT HAVE SUBSTANCES IN HIS BODY which was proven by the autopsy.
People don't die often from tazers, so it would be okay if they were using them for a reasonable situation. This wasn't. Is it okay for a cop to tazer you whenever they want to? Should they tazer everyone they want to arrest? Do they like tazering as opposed to the "classic" way of taking down a suspect. Lazy fucks.
Yeah, all cops should rot, god, who cares about theft, rape, murder, if the cops were gone, this guy would have survived!! Sure tons more would have died, BUT THIS GUY WOULD BE ALIVE!! THATS ALL THAT MATTERS!!!!!!!
Lazy fucks risking their lives, taking bullets, getting killed on the job... god why are they so fuckin lazy. (sure death rate isn't high, but who knows when some junky will stab you with a needle or cough malaria in your face (yes... knocked up quote))
yes im being an asshole to prove a point, but shit happens.
impressive fighting them still after getting tasered.
so how do you know the guy just didn't give himself a heart attack from being freaked out that he was getting arrested. (like i said before, i duno what any tests revealed so tell me :P)
guess they should have just beat the shit out of him cause that would have looked a lot better :P
Let's consider the cops' situation here for a minute.
There's a guy who has been damaging property and throwing things around. He is holding a metal object.
While tasering the guy may or may not have been warranted, it certainly was not "disgraceful".
Who ever claimed that all police should rot and are 'lazy fucks' you are an ignorant bugger. You have no clue about anything do you? You have no idea how these men and women constantly on a daily basis risk their lives to allow us to be safe in our every day lives. You are the lazy fuck in the fact that you don't take the time to understand what these people do and you are the one who should rot.
First of all, don't they have a rule that tells them to use weapons (lethal/non-lethal) as a last resort? One of the cops was heard saying some thing like "Are we going to taser him?" like 0:25 before they actually did it.
25 seconds is way too short. They should have tried to communicate with him instead of going for the easy way out. So yes, in that regard they are lazy fucks.
Also, police officers are trained to give cpr right? They caused the man's heart to stop and then did jack shit about it. Once again, in that regard they are lazy fucks.
There is no "rule" telling them not to use any weapons (lethal/non-lethal) as a last resort. They are supposed to use their handgun if they feel their life is being threatened or if another's life is being threatened. If they EVER feel like they or others are threatened then they have the right to use any weapon to do what they can to stop the threat and at times they have less than a nanosecond to decide such as this case. It does not matter If it was only twenty-five seconds into a video, they saw him with what looked like a weapon and they had to stop this threat. It is much better that they used a taser than the handgun.
Communication? Bullshit. Like you have time to try and stop a crazed man by talking with him.
When they realized that his heart stopped they may not have given him cpr and why they did that I cannot tell you but that does not mean they did nothing. They called the paramedics and did what else they could have.
Once again another person knows nothing and shouldn't be putting in their two cents. You are in fact a lazy fuck for not doing anything to actually learn about the truth.
And the funniest thing is the RCMP are not accountable to the province like the vpd, so people if you want to make a point take it up with the federal government, cause Im sure theyre going to listen and care
i wouldnt want to get herpes cuz i gave some random guy cpr, lol
so the video is shit quality.. but i don't think it should be undermined because of this.. there are questions that the police will need to answer in regards to their behavior but i'm more interested in knowing what's up with that ridiculous autopsy report..
Im not saying it didn't happen but get off the cops back, its not like they go around looking for people to kill? And for the third or fourth time the guy brought the attention to himself, he didnt deserve to die but he set off the chain of events...what the hell do you expect in airports post 9/11?
Lets say the guy was acting up and the guy caught him on camera, then the guy got on a plane and punched a stewardess everyone would be crying why didnt the cops stop him at the airport, cause we'd all see that video of him acting violent
everyone will bitch at them for something because they get pissed off when they get a ticket they deserve.
A taser works through a current, meaning there must be two nodes in the flesh for the electricity to travel. The further apart the nodes are, the more damaging the shock (compare two nodes from one end of the forearm to the other with two nodes from one end of the body to the other). What isn't taken into account is that people may often sustain injury by falling after the shock or as a result of excited delirium produced in large part by the taser's shock. I've spoken with countless cops (officers, cadets, rookies, and veterans); I'm a criminology student after all. Proper policy is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS communication first. In this case communication was somewhat hindered (I say somewhat because I think the use of body language and certain gestures are universal). But unless the perpetrator is making threatening gestures, the use of any weapons is discouraged. The right procedure is to use the corresponding amount of force. If there is no immediate threat, the response should be corresponding. Similarly, a high amount of threat with little prospect for negotiation will bring about the use of appropriate force. I mean you no offence when I say that I sincerely doubt that you have ever been zapped by a taser. It fucking hurts (X0,000 volts running through your body with newer models being more powerful). Tasers and other electroshock weapons have even been used as torture devices. In the video, no attempts were made to even restrain Dziekanski. If the four cops had not been able to restrain Dziekanski, I would have found it justifiable to use an appropriate amount of taser force (appropriate =/= lethal). Dziekanski's writhing in pain should not have served as an indicator for the officers to keep zapping him.